HOH Shouldn't Date Deaf?

One Hears Some, Other Hears Less

About Deafness/HOH received the following e-mail, which was posted to the forum. It started one of the most interesting relationship discussions ever held on the forum.

I am HOH and come from a late deafened family.I started losing my hearing in my teens. I didn't learn to sign until much later and my skills still are not perfect, but I would like them to be. I can't get any practice though.

I am with a Deaf man who is very sweet but he has been cast out of the community because HOH are not supposed to date Deaf, apparently. We tried to get involved here but noone would sign to me because they were trying to punish him for being with me instead of a Deaf woman. He has resisted the pressure, but people call him a traitor and use that rude sign for "hearing in the head" to him, which hurts him a lot.

I can understand why Deaf don't want just anyone coming into the community,and I understand that as I have been discriminated against too now that I dont' hear much at al. But I don't know why some tend to look down on deaf people who are Oral or learned to sign later or were mainstreamed. These were decisions their parents made, not them. It's not their fault. I also really don't understand why HOH can't date Deaf either. I get the same treatment from Hearing people that many Deaf have gotten because I don't hear much anymore, and I do support Deaf culture. But the Deaf culture around here has acted like I am trying to steal away one of their best Deaf and won't let us in. They have told him that the only way they will allow him to come back is if he dumps me and dates only Deaf women. Are there other HOH/Deaf or even Hearing/Deaf couples who have been shunned from the local community? Why does this happen? I am more than willing to live a Deaf life because we plan to marry and I want him to be happy, but no one is giving us the opportunity. I am starting to wonder if the high divorce rate between Deaf/non Deaf or HOH is because of the isolation and pressure that is put on these couples. Right now we are stuck in the Hearing world with only a very few Deaf who will talk to us, and we are trying to find a better Deaf community that is more openminded about Deaf/HOH romantic relationships. Does anyone know if such a place exists?
HOH Shouldn't Date Deaf?

Selected comments from forum members and About visitors follow:

"I'm very sorry that this persons local Deaf community feels this way ... lucky I don't think it's the "typical" feeling of most Deaf communities. I'm HoH , and have never felt anything other then welcome in the Deaf community, The Deaf community here has many people who refer to themselves as hoh, and Deaf. Here acceptance into the community seems to be much more about shared values, langauge, history , then about points charted on an audiogram."
ANIJ21

"I am starting to wonder if the high divorce rate between Deaf/non Deaf or HOH is because of the isolation and pressure that is put on these couples."

Is it true that there is a high divorce rate on these couples? My folks live in a retirement community where half of every couple seems to be pretty deaf and no one blinks an eye.

Also I have been married a couple decades to a hearing man. No problems. My lonliness stems from little exposure to the deaf community.

I wonder if this couple might find acceptance among the hearing majority if they are barred from the Deaf?"
TOADIETOES

"I just recently broke up with my high-status culturally Deaf boyfriend. I am HOH but late deafened as well. We did not break up bec of communication problems, I am pretty fluent in ASL and in group situations, I made sure whether hearing or not, that everyone knew how to sign or at least fingerspell or was willing to write to my boyfriend. Any friends I had who refused to do this, I gradually stopped hanging with. I can talk pretty well, so people assume I am hearing. Not the case. But would like to say to all the people who grew up culturally Deaf and who now refuse to date hearing people because of a few bad experiences that this is not really necessary. It's like eating one bad orange, without realizing it was that one that was rotton, not the fruit itself. It also doean't mean that all hearing are like that, tho more are than should be. No one should have to put up with hearing who refuse to learn to sign, but just because some wont is no reason to assume that everyone who is hearing will behave like that.

Will also mention that this Deaf community(where we live, won't say where) makes dating Deaf very hard if you are HOH. They snub a lot and can be very prejudiced about it, saying I was stealing him from the Deaf community and that he was a traitor for not dating a Deaf woman. I wanted to live in the Deaf world with him, but the Deaf community around here refused to let us, ignoring us and sending him nasty emails and backstabbing. I am sad about that and all the pressure that was put on him. Seems like there is no support for mixed relationships in the Deaf

http://deafness.about.com/cs/friendshiparticles/a/hohanddeaf.htm

Deaf Polyamory

when deaf people love more

What is Deaf Poly Life?

The Yahoo group Deaf PolyLife isa groupofdeaf and hard of hearingmen and women who discuss thelifestyle of openly loving more than one person, known aspolyamory.

The Deaf PolyLife group maintains a Deaf Polyamory Resource Center. This resource center provides a detailed explanation of polyamory and links to several polyamory resources.

John "Raven" Schumacher is the leader of the Deaf Poly group, and is a junior at Gallaudet majoriing in ASL and deaf studies.He answered some questions posed by About:

Q: How did you come to be involved in deaf polyamory?

A: I was once a practicing Deaf Minister and did a study on marriage which led to learning about marriage and polygamy in the Bible but in my Internet research using the word just "poly" I came across a group of christians who support the idea of polyamory being actually biblical.

I came to what I still believe is a logical conclusion and as well as my bible study group that their information that polyamory and that you could still be a christian was correct.

My views on sex without marriage and in marriage as long as all people in the relationship agree with others truly evolved after this and I no longer wanted to be involved in most organized religion after than. I still hold my credentials as a minister and still freelance and help others.

After 2 years of studying the other polyamory issues on websites which tripled over the last 6 years. My wife and I discussed the idea of polyamory and she encouraged me to look and we worked out a set of agreements about what to look for, communication, and what to do if I found someone interested, etc. Assuring her that I would not leave her to find another woman...I've since had several successful relationships. I have now had the desire of making the Deaf Community more aware of polyamory. So I established the Deaf Polyamory Resource Center on the www and the Deaf Poly Life email list.

Q: Although your Yahoo group is small at this time do you have any idea how many deaf people are involved with the polyamory lifestyle?

A: I would estimate think approximately 1 percent of the USA deaf population... in the Deaf Community we have tons of people who cheat and have affairs or are swingers but this is not polyamory. I truly think if these Deaf people were more aware of polyamory in the Deaf Community people then they wouldn't need to cheat, nor would they need to hide their affairs and put their partners at risk for diseases. Being open and honest about their desires and needs is one of the reasons why polyamory is so fast spreading in the world today.

Q: How does the deaf community feel about the deaf poly lifestyle?

A: Their reaction has been anything from full agreement to absolute shock, envy and indignation from BOTH men and women. At times I have heard the Deaf Community make my life the topic of the gossip grapevine which is to be expected. Much misunderstandings about polyamory exists which is why I want to have more Deaf Community awareness about "polyamory: what is is and what it is not." I have many Deaf people ask me many questions and are curious just how living a polyamorous lifestyle works for me. Sometimes it is difficult because I am asked these questions in Deaf Clubs or around many Deaf people. I dont mind but the assumption is usually that people think I am trying to convert people to become polyamorous which is not what Im trying to do. I just want more Deaf people to become aware of what polyamory is.

Q: Do you feel accepted/respected or have you met with any hostility in the deaf community at large?

A: Since I "came out of the closet" being polyamorous I have seen reactions which have been mixed from Deaf men AND women: indifference, shock, amazement, envy or complete lack of acknowledgement that polyamory exists in the Deaf Community.

when deaf people love more

I do believe I am respected for who I am and at the same time I get some negative reactions from older women who feel I am hurting my wife in some way which I am not.I am told sometimes by the older generation of Deaf adults or the Deaf religious community that I am making my wife suffer by seeing other women, which is not the case. I tell them to ask her themselves if they dont believe me. (Many do and are astounded by her answer that she is not hurt by this and actually encourages and supports me - I'm lucky to have such a special woman in my life)

A Deaf Polyamorist

Mary Lee (not real name), a deaf polyamorist, explained how she came to be involved in the deaf poly lifestyle: "Most of my deaf friends know that I am open-minded about sex. One deaf friend suggested that should become the 'Dr.

Ruth' of the deaf community and get a Ph.D in sexuality. I knew that it was a joke, but I was still curious to see if there was any Internet material on deaf people and sexuality.

During my search, I ran across a new term, 'polyamory', that totally fascinated me. I understood how 'poly' meant multiple, and 'amor' meant love. I read avidly that polyamory was a broad term for an alternative lifestyle involving multiple partners in open and lasting relationships. I searched for a deaf polyamorist and actually found a name and email address of a deaf person that came out about his polyamory.

Unfortunately, when I emailed this person, the email bounced back. Defeated, I gave up the search. Last semester, my deaf friend told me about a deaf person she knew at Gallaudet University that was open-minded about sex like me. When she told me that he had a Yahoo group for deaf polyamory, I immediately signed up for it, hungry for more information about polyamory and curious about the other deaf people that belonged to this group. I began reading the archives and discovered that a famous deaf person had been exposed to ridicule from another deaf adversary because of his postings on this Yahoo group. I was surprised to see that the famous deaf person was still a member after such an invasion of privacy that I sent a note "Bravo!" The deaf moderator asked me about my note and during our IM conversations, we discovered he was the same person that I had tried to email in the first place long ago! What a small world!The moderator decided to delete the public yahoo group and create a more secure one with no archives."

http://deafness.about.com/cs/friendshiparticles/a/polyamory_2.htm

Sign Language - Signing Suppers

Or, Silent Suppers or ASL Dinners

Signing suppers have become a staple of deaf community social life.

What is a signing supper, also known as a "silent supper" or "ASL dinner?" It is a social event where a group of people meets for dinner at a local restaurant. The group may consist of both deaf people and hearing people (or only deaf people) who want to practice their sign language, make new friends, or just plain socialize. Sign language students and parents of deaf children especially enjoy going to signing suppers as it gives them a chance to practice their skills in a relaxed environment and to interact with members of the deaf community.

I realized just how significant a part of deaf community social life the local silent suppers/ASL dinners had become when at a recent ASL dinner, I found that more people had come from out of state than locally.

Deaf people were willing to drive long distances just for the chance to socialize with other deaf people at a restaurant.

It is easy to set up a signing supper or ASL dinner. Find a restaurant in your area that is willing to allow a group of about 25 people to take over seats for an average of three to four hours. Be sure that the restaurant does not mind people staying and chatting for that long, because after dinner people may chat for hours. The last ASL dinner I went to started at 6 p.m. and the others were still chatting when I left at 10 p.m.

Accessibility of the chosen restaurants is important. To be sure that people who can not drive or do not have cars may attend, try to find restaurants accessible to public transportation if possible.

It is also a good idea if the chosen restaurant has long tables, allows tables to be put together to create a long table, or tables can be set up next to each other. The long table and adjacent table formats encourage more interaction among dinner participants. Adjacent tables make it easy to "rotate" from one group of people to another.

In addition to being a way to make friends and practice sign language skills, signing suppers can also be a good way to meet significant others. A deaf man and a hearing woman had met at the signing suppers when they started in their area. Several years later, they were married.

If you go to a signing supper/silent supper/ASL dinner, you don't go for the food - you go for the people.

http://deafness.about.com/cs/interact/a/signingsuppers.htm

Deaf-Hearing Marriage

Life in a Mixed Marriage

What is it like being married to a hearing person (and for a hearing person married to a deaf person)? About asked a deaf-hearing couple.

Deaf Spouse:

• When we visit relatives, it is hearing spouse who can communicate with them easily, while I am limited to utilizing my lipreading skills as best as I can and writing back-and-forth.
• When we have birthday parties for the kids, if some of the other parents don't sign well, I have difficulty communicating with them and often must rely on either other parents who sign more fluently to interpret, or my hearing spouse.
• When we are out in public, for example in restaurants or hair salons, sometimes hearing spouse does the explaining if they don't understand my speech (my speech is the type not easily understood by hearing people who don't know me).

• Whenever possible, I do try to communicate for myself by speaking, writing, or pointing so as not to become dependent on hearing spouse.
• In the early days of our deaf-hearing relationship, hearing spouse was not well accepted by the deaf community. It has taken time, but now hearing spouse is fully accepted. Hearing spouse's willingness to use sign language and participate in the deaf community has been important to our marriage.
• Our deaf kids' first language is ASL and he does not always understand them. I am often in the role of reverse interpreter, voicing what my children sign.
• When we get together with other deaf people who sign mostly ASL, I am often in the role of reverse interpreter, voicing what they sign if they don't use voice.
• Hearing spouse's expressive signing is ok, but hearing spouse's receptive signing is not as good, meaning that hearing spouse relies heavily on my voice for communication. If I did not talk, I don't know if we would still be married. I'm trying to turn off my voice more to get hearing spouse to improve receptive skills. (Communication is one of the biggest problems in deaf-hearing marriages).

Hearing spouse:

• I still have difficulty receiving signs--I have not been signing all my life, or even most of it, and am not with people who sign at work. As part of the deaf-hearing marriage, I continue to work on my receptivity.
• If deaf spouse yells for me at home, I can't yell back. I have to go to where deaf spouse is and find out what deaf spouse wants. Our kids now do this too. In a way, they are taking advantage of the fact that I am hearing and they are deaf!! (Deaf spouse: I'm aware that I do this and I shouldn't be doing it. I'm working on learning to go look for hearing spouse, not yell for hearing spouse. That's one thing you have to do in a deaf-hearing marriage).
• Deaf spouse is used to the expressiveness of deaf people, and reads a lack of expressiveness on my part or on the part of other hearing people as apathy or lack of enthusiasm. I tell deaf spouse that that is not necessarily true, since hearing people often express emotions through voice more than face.
• Deaf spouse is still not comfortable in a social situation with mostly hearing people, and I am still not comfortable in a situation with mostly deaf people. However, it is easier for me in a deaf gathering than it is for deaf spouse in a hearing gathering, because there are more likely to be hearing people or people who voice at a deaf event than there are to be deaf people or people who sign at a hearing event.
• Actually, most of our social life tends to center around the parents of our kids' classmates. This works out well, because most of the parents are either hearing people who can sign or deaf people who use voice.

Hearing spouse: For all the problems of a deaf-hearing marriage and of raising deaf kids if you are hearing, I have never regretted marrying deaf spouse or having deaf kids, and I would do the same thing again, a million times.

Deaf spouse: And if you are deaf like me and in a deaf-hearing relationship, you may find yourself sometimes wishing that your partner were deaf or hard of hearing too. However, what is important is the character of the person you have chosen to marry, not how well he or she can hear.

http://deafness.about.com/cs/friendshiparticles/a/mixedmarriage.htm

Signs of Love - Deaf and Hard of Hearing Style

Love, Friendship, Romance in the Deaf Community

Matchmaker, matchmaker, make me a match. Find me a find, catch me a catch — and make him or her deaf or hard of hearing. As the deaf community expands, so have opportunities for finding that special someone in the deaf community, or expressing your feelings for a special someone in a "deaf" way.

Online Matchmaking

Although general disability dating services exist online, there are also services specifically for the deaf community. Several services have sprung up, giving deaf and hard of hearing singles many choices. These services offer free registration, but in order to be able to actually contact someone a subscription must be purchased.

About Deafness forum - The forum at About Deafness/HOH has a "Making Friends" folder that seekers can use to post "advertisements" for friends or partners, and they can post pictures of themselves using HTML code.

• To do this, select the "Source" option when composing a new message on the forum and post your picture using this code:. In addition, you can e-mail someone by clicking on their user name; this pops up a box. The box has a button labeled "send e-mail." This allows you to send an e-mail by filling out a form. This is not a matchmaking service, but it is free.
• ASLSingles.com - Pay matchmaking service. Can not browse without registering first.
• Deaf Match International (Deafmatchinternational.com) - Deaf Match International is a pay online matchmaking database that allows non-subscribers to browse, but in order to be able to send messages, seekers must pay for subscriptions. Photographs are optional. Searches can be done by age, sex, sexual orientation, location, or keyword.
• DeafSinglesConnection - Pay matchmaking database. Provides notification of when people sign on, post, and join.
• Deafs.com also requires registration to be able to view photos.

Food

On Valentine's Day, you can be romantic AND spend your money in the deaf community by purchasing cookies, etc. from Gimmee Jimmy's, a cookie company established and run by a deaf man, Jimmy Libman. (Of course, you don't have to wait for Valentine's Day)

Cards and Dolls

DeafResources.com offers free online e-cards with deaf valentine's day themes. Cards and dolls with deaf themes can be bought via vendors of deaf/hoh products.

Stories

On the PBS American Love Stories web site, there are stories of true love in the deaf community:

• Deaf and Hearing - A hearing woman describes her romance and marriage to a deaf man.
• We Listened to Ourselves - A hearing man describes his romance and relationship with a deaf woman.

Deafness in Romance Novels

Myshelf.com, a book review site, has a special page devoted to deafness in romance novels.

My Own Love Story

In January, 1984 I was the editor of the NTID Student Communication Center newspaper. One evening, when I was working in the SCC office in the basement of the NTID Dining Commons, Bob stopped by. He wanted to be a photographer for the newspaper, and I "hired" him. (I like to say that I'm still his boss today!)

A friendship began to develop, and soon Bob and I were doing things together every weekend for three months straight. We also shared some meals in the cafeteria and did laundry together as well. Then, around April, we just stopped doing things together although we still talked to each other.

After I left NTID in 1985, we did not see each other or hear from each other. One day in 1989, we found each other again through an early deaf newsgroup. We exchanged a few e-mails and then again lost contact.

There was no contact again until early 2000. One night I was chatting with someone via AIM who had known both me and Bob. I said to him, "I remember my old buddy Bob..." and he put us back in touch with each other. Bob and I began to chat, and the chats grew longer and longer.

He came to visit in October 2000 and we saw each other again for the first time in fifteen years. It was a bit of a shock. The boy had become a man and I, the girl, a woman.

Bob moved in with me later that Fall, and we have been together since then. As it turns out, both of us had never forgotten each other during those fifteen years apart.

How did you meet your deaf/hoh partner? Online? In college at NTID or Gallaudet? Share your deaf love story!

http://deafness.about.com/cs/friendshiparticles/a/signsoflove.htm